AT4W - Marville #5

(116 votes, average 4.92 out of 5)
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The Atop the Fourth Wall DVD is still available! Details here: http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolinks/linkara/specials/39746-atop-the-fourth-wall-dvd-vol-1-secret-origins

Comments (212)
  • Xamrin  - RSS
    I seem to get to watch these early. My RSS feed picks up on it faster than it gets added to this list.

    But while I'm here... FFFIIIIRRRRRRSSSSSTTT!!!! 1!!!!ONE!!!!!!
  • LordNifty
    For some reason, as of the time of this posting, this isn't showing up on the front page; it scrolls from "Last Angry Geek - Comic Book Issues - The Wolverine Vlog" right to "Doug Walker: The Last Airbender Vlogs - The Dragonbending Masters".
  • Kefke_Wren
    Well, by Marville logic, your post is now immortal.
  • SpeedyEric  - “…Pollo, get the booze.”
    avatar
    Nice job on picking now to review the 5th issue of Marville, because Wolverine is in this comic (for reasons that are stupid) and “The Wolverine” just came out this past weekend, and it was a really good follow-up film for the character.

    4:13- I also didn’t notice that that was one of Wolverine’s claws. At first, I thought it was a straw or something that Mickey would use to snort up lines of cocaine on the mirror she’s lying naked on.

    I haven’t seen the movie “One Million Years B.C.” yet, but I feel like I’d rather be watching that than subject myself into this form of madness.

    16:15- FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, SOMEONE REMOVE EVERYONE’S SPEECH BUBBLES SO I DON’T HAVE TO READ THEIR STUPIDITY ANYMORE!!! Oh, and if you can, IMPLODE THE FREAKIN’ MARVILLE UNIVERSE WHILE YOUR AT IT!!!

    After all the BS Bill Jemas gave us about human evolution, I’d also like to go into my Happy Place.

    In speaking of The New Guardians, if this comic suddenly had Snowflame, that would be a step up.

    Nice job on the 5th issue of Marville, Mr. Jemas. You took our theories on human evolution, locked it into a dungeon, injected it with drugs, raped it, and out came this abomination nine months later. …Damn, I can be dark.

    Oh, and Lewis, perfect choice to use Weird Al’s “Everything You Know is Wrong” for the end credits, because the title of that song perfectly sums up what kind of person Bill Jemas probably is in real life according to his writing in this mess we all know as Marville.
  • redhairsword
    avatar
    The sudden introduction of SNOWFLAME! improves anything by at least 1 or 2 steps.
  • Steve Potter
    avatar
    I was going to correct you by pointing out that ligers are infertile, but after doing some research, it turns out that there have been some cases of ligers reproducing. THAT SAID, it is still VERY rare, and I think there are only two reported cases of it. So I suppose that plot point is a bit forgivable. Just a bit.
  • Xandermorph
    Really? That's pretty cool - I was actually about to comment about the exact same thing you did :P
    But yeah, turns out you're totally right! It's apparently some new, off-chance genetic mutation, ligers being able to breed.

    Even so it's not as if the Marville writing staff actually knew any better - they still pulled it right out of their ass :P
  • Falconfly
    avatar
    Ligers, however, have nothing on waterfowl hybrids, which are very fertile
  • Kinnikufan
    Thanks ctrl-f for keeping me from making a redundant comment. Cool info on liger breeding, btw.
  • doommagic
    avatar
    At least a few different small cat species can interbreed and produce fertile offspring also. There's even a few different domestic cat breeds that originated from crossbreeding with other species, like the Asian leopard cat and serval produced the Bengal and Savannah cat respectively.
  • Camelking
    I checked it out. Female Ligers are fertile, but males are not. So technically Ligers can't breed. But Lions and Tigers can breed with female ligers.
  • Darkcloud1111
    avatar
    Was that a Bill and Ted reference when you said that they might stop WW3 by forming a rock band that united the world, because if it was, that would be awesome.
  • ladydiskette
    avatar
    So wait, if this was suppose to imply that humans evolved from Wolverine, wouldn't they be inherited with the healing factor gene and if so, humanity would not have been infected with all of the most historical plagues and epidemics in history such as the Black Plague, The Influenza Epidemic of 1900s, or the AIDs epidemic since they would possibly survive these diseases.


    Not to mention the world would be more crowded because less possibilities of deaths and age expectancy increase.

    I am just saying after all these years we would notice if we had Wolverine's Healing Factor/Genes as a whole.

    "For a teenager, he sure has a receding hairline there." - I don't know, I think that looks more like a widow's peak.
  • cdrood
    Not necessarily. The healing factor would have to be a dominant genetic trait, or more likely, the correct combination of dominant genetic traits. Just because it's super useful and convenient wouldn't guarantee that it would be passed on.
  • GrlGmr
    avatar
    Considering there's a scene from Bill & Ted 2 after the credits, I think so.
  • Mousy Voice
    avatar
    I was curious when you talked about neanderthals and homo sapiens interbreeding. I own a book called Prehistoric: The Definitive Visual History of Life on Earth (I highly recommend it if you're interested in paleontology) and the book has a whole section on the evolution of hominids. According to my book, there is no evidence that neanderthals ever fought, interbred, or even interacted with homo sapiens. It also goes on to explain that the neanderthals were quite successful despite not having bred with Wolverine. They managed to live for over 300,000 years in the hostile weather of Europe and unlike the African bred homo sapiens, the neanderthals are the only known hominids that were evolved specifically for a cold weather climate and lived on an all meat diet. They were highly adept at making stone tools and they were accomplished hunters and scavengers. So considering how adept they were at surviving in cold climates and the fact that they never interbred or fought against homo sapiens, it begs the question: how did the neanderthals go extinct? There are two possible reasons. First of all, the climate in Europe was not as stable as it is today. With constantly changing temperatures and erratic weather, it put enormous strain on the neanderthals. The second reason is that homo sapiens were smarter than the neanderthals and thus could form closer bonds with other tribes and they were able to form complex hunting strategies and means of communicating. When the homo sapiens moved north into Europe, they probably were able to efficiently take away a lot of the food and resources the neanderthals needed to survive. In other words, the neanderthals were outclassed and thus died out. Fascinating, isn't it?
  • Extreme-Madness  - re:Mousy Voice
    avatar
    How old is this book? Some new research suggests that homo sapiens actually interfere with Neanderthals, and that in fact most modern people outside Africa have some Neanderthal DNA.
    (But maybe I should check out the latest research to see if it reveal something new.)
  • Mousy Voice
    avatar
    Prehistoric: The Definitive Visual History of Life on Earth is copyrighted 2009.
  • SchrodingersCat  - Re: Neanderthals
    Actually, only people of European ancestry have any Neanderthal DNA.
    And even at that, only about 5% of modern Europeans have it.
    Modern Homo Sapiens didn't exist at the time.
    Cro-Magnon did.
    It looks like the Cro-Magnons killed off or out-competed most of the Neanderthals, then interbred with the last few.
    Cro-Magnon became the ancestors of Homo Sapiens.
  • Extreme-Madness
    avatar
    Strange, I thought how much is known Cro-Magnon were modern humans. The oldest fossils of modern humans (not fully modern) date back to 200 000 years (long before Cro-Magnon).
  • Firelock
    avatar
    Mule- A mix between a male donkey and a female horse, although they are often infertile with the rare exception.
    And there are Grolar bears which are a mix between a Polar Bear and a Grizzly and they occur naturally in the wild.
  • Sliced Ice
    avatar
    I'm completely stunned by the utter stupidity of this comic. It's not even a story anymore. It's just a pile of words and pictures and nonsense.

    Linkara, clearly you need a hug and a sizable bottle of alcohol to get you through this experience.
  • ladydiskette
    avatar
    The image of Linksano flipping off Marville #5 is all that needed to be said about this comic book.
  • Makutateridax200  - The ONE thing Marville got right in all that bullc
    interbreeding was a likely result of Neanderthals and Humans Coexisting during the last few tens of thousands of years of the Ice Age

    infact i myself read somewhere that Most people have 1-4% of Neanderthal DNA in their Genetic Structure as a result of such Interbreeding


    Everything else Marville said thus-far is wrong though
  • SchrodingersCat  - RE: Maxutateridax
    Actually it's most modern EUROPEANS who have Neanderthal DNA; since Neanderthals only lived in Europe.
    Africans, for example, have none.
  • Makutateridax200  - Part of an Article From Discovery.com
    - A newly mapped Neanderthal genome provides strong evidence that humans and Neanderthals interbred.

    - Between 1-4 percent of the DNA of many humans living today likely came from Neanderthals.

    - People of European and Asian heritage are most likely to carry the Neanderthal genes.
  • Zexaal
    avatar
    I've seen a good bit of AT4W by this point....Amazons Attack, Countdown, Cable...but out of all of those, I can count on Marville to CONSISTENTLY make my head hurt. Seriously...that's the only thing that's consistent.

    Just....I mean....it' s.....WHHYYYYYYYYY?!?!?!? ! Why does this exist?!?!
  • VampByDay
    So, I have a B.S. in Anthropology, (and yes, I did flip off the comic at that point.) and I'm working on getting a graduate degree in anthropology, so here is the deal with Neanderthals (technically pronounced 'NeanderTALLs, but no one outside anthropologists care about that.)

    The jury is still out, last I heard. Some believe, and are searching for genetic evidence, that humans native to Europe intermingled with neanderthals, some don't. It's kind of hard to tell. Genetics is murky at that point (especially since humans and neaderthal DNA is so damn close, and we are working with 50000 year old DNA samples.)

    The BASICS as far as most anthropologists are concerned (and again, this is theory and hotly debated) is that Homo erectus spread out of Africa, though Europe, continental Asia, and to some islands. Several branches of erectus broke off, Neanderthals in Europe, Homo floresiensis (the hobbit people) in Indonesia, and so on.

    There were several offshoots in Africa, but eventually Homo Sapiens won out (mostly because they were smart enough to start fishing, and when the weather changed, the other varieties couldn't keep getting food.) Eventually Homo sapiens spread out of Africa again (following erectus) and MAY have mated with SOME of the last neanderthals (evidence suggests that Homo neanderthalis was massive and couldn't come up with enough food to supply their big bodies when a mini ice-age hit.)

    While the show 'Bones' is really bad at science sometimes, they did get one thing right. In one episode they find pretty much indisputable proof that humans and neanderthals mated, and it is treated like a huge deal. And, if that was found in real life it WOULD be a huge deal. So yes, it is a THEORY that Homo sapiens and Homo Neanderthalis mated.

    Also, on a side note, that part about god 'not letting two different animals mate and produce fertile offspring' is really stupid. The Linneaan classification system is a contrivance, something we humans use to try and classify something that is not easily classifiable. The real workings of 'whether you can produce fertile offspring' with something are far, far, far more complex.
  • Gborr  - If we are at anthropology...
    avatar
    Am I the only one who got really uncomfortable about the fact that every single human in this comic is caucasian? I thought it's elementary-school level knowledge that the first hominids came from Africa and more than likely had black or at least really dark skin. How do you even make a mistake like that... unless of course if it wasn't a mistake but a deliberate choice, in which case, ouch. -.-
  • kittyjo13
    It's because all humans came from wolverine, obviously. Also Neanderthals and 'humans' looked exactly the same, so they to are as wolverine even before the coming of wolverine. Halleluyah!

    Seriously though, this grown mans ignorance frightens me. Even the most basic facts of evolution he gets wrong. My little brother understood this better than him back when he was in elementary school.

    So long my faith in humanity, I'll miss you.
  • pryanterry  - As an anthro major
    "Anthropologists are people who never got jobs"
    ...
    I'm going to destroy this author if I ever meet him.
  • The_Irate_Reader
    Need help hiding the body? Or where you planning on a technique that doesn't leave a body?

    I recommend napalm. Fire solves everything.
  • KenxKao
    avatar
    Not sure if Napalm would be appropriate. How about thermite instead. Works wonders on Mythbusters.

    Also, add Mythbusters to that list of things that are better.
  • The_Irate_Reader
    Thermite is nice. Hmmm...
    Of course, the best solution would be to preserve him in a block of concrete so that when future generations dig him up for research purposes they have a well-preserved sample of this rare subspecies of dumbass.
  • Ralean
    avatar
    http://en.wikipedia.org/ wiki/Denisova_hominin

    (not to be pedantic, just informative)
    Don't forget Homo Denisova, which is possibly a third branch of humanity. Which (to summarize the link) is an Asian branch that may have intermingled with the local humans much the same way that Neanderthals did with the European humans.

    What does this mean? Humans will have sex with anything. Not really surprising there, though.

    Also, THE GREATER GOOD.
  • The_Irate_Reader
    It all finally makes sense. Countdown. Amazons Attack. One More Day. Liefeld. All of it.

    The entire comic industry is a pawn of Darkseid in his unending search for the anti-logic equation. Occasionally he'll send a minion through to approve something like this, hoping that this time he will find the ultimate weapon that will crush the hope and sanity of all who stand against him.

    Which minion? GRANNY GOODNESS!
  • Chunin2000
    avatar
    It's amazing how Marville's stupidity keeps getting worse.

    Bill Jemas went from Seltzerberg to Rick Perry in the first four issues and now in the fifth issue the Seltzerberg and Rick Perry mindsets have merged.

    I can see why you need a lot of booze to get through an issue of Marville
  • The_Irate_Reader
    I never realized that stupid could hurt so bad. I am willing to bet that this series is singlehandedly responsible for creating the plot hole that is now the awesomeverse.

    I'm not certain, but I think this is a contender for stupider and more nonsensical than the Warrior comics. Both of them are windows into the minds of their creators, and through those windows we see something truly horrifying.
  • muppaphoniac12
    avatar
    I just graduated with a degree in Anthropology.

    My skin is crawling with disgust for this comic.
  • Sigma0283
    avatar
    Bill is a dumb ass. His comics have given me a Migraine. Linkara and suggestions of what I can take (Other than Aspirin) to relieve the pain?
  • SchrodingersCat
    Pineapple is good for headaches(and also for fatigue).
  • ladydiskette
    avatar
    Really?

    Maybe I should try it sometime.
  • ShadowHand
    avatar
    Another great episode and yeah I took an anthropology class and really enjoyed it and respect the professor who taught it so I flipped off the screen when that one line came up.
  • Vausch
    I...I'm insulted.

    I don't even study anthropology, but I'm utterly insulted.

    This comic is what I think is the worst type of idiocy, the kind where the idiot learned just enough to SOUND smart so other people who are ignorant to the subject will believe them at face value. I find that kind of idiocy dangerous. I've debated creationists before when we were considering teaching it in our school (Intelligent design my fanny), their arguments were exactly like that but... I don't want to say smarter because they were very wrong, but they didn't sound AS stupid.

    16:53: FUCK YOU, JEMAS. GodDAMN I hate that argument. "No living scientist has ever witnessed evolution" BULLSHIT. We have documented cases of evolution happening right before us, we have witnessed viruses and bacteria evolve to become immune to antibiotics and anti-virals, WE HAVE SEEN IT HAPPEN. Sorry, that one just really makes me rage.
  • cdrood
    It's not just that. It's that any scientist worth his salt would be the first to admit we don't have all the facts and that theories need to change when new information is uncovered. Einstein's Theory of Relativity has been expanded upon in the decades since he came up with it. If anything, everything keeps becoming more and more complicated. However, it doesn't mean Einstein was wrong, just like it doesn't mean Darwin was wrong. It just means there's more to find out, but the foundations are still sound.

    It's this off handed way Jemas apparently has kind of heard of these theories, didn't bother to do any basic research, came to his own conclusions on what they are, and then dismisses them that is so off putting. It reminds me of the time the church my wife used to go to had a guest pastor. The regular guy is pretty level headed and doesn't venture into mocking science. This guy however, pulled the, "If man evolved from monkeys, why are there still monkeys?" card. It took everything I had to keep from embarrassing my wife and mocking him openly for his lack of knowledge on the subject.
  • StaticFactory  - Well, I DO happen to study anthropolgy, and...
    ...I GOT SOMETHING TO SAY:

    Wow. Just, WOW. This comic has stirred up a passionate, visceral anger deep within my soul that I didn't even know was there. And it's not even about me.

    I mean, what the fuck do I know? I'm just an anthropology student, not even at the level of specialization yet. But he who says "anthropologists are just people who didn't get real jobs" is MOCKING MY MENTORS.

    This comic mocks my Prehistory professor, Dr. Fisher, whose group discovered and named the Beauronnian industry, a localized and previously-unknown stone tool style. This comic mocks my school's department director, Dr. Wall, who runs one of the best anthropology field schools in the goddamn country. This comic mocks my cultural anthropology professor, Dr. Rehak, who wrote a book about her work with FORMER PRISONERS OF WAR and will stir some important controversy in her home country! YOU DO NOT FUCKING MAKE LIGHT OF THAT WOMAN'S WORK.

    Worst of all, it mocks the pursuit of scientific evidence--REAL traces of things on which we base our theories about WHERE WE CAME FROM--and it mocks the people who think that the pursuit of such traces is a worthwhile career.

    Bill Jemas, DO NOT SPEAK OF WHAT YOU DO NOT KNOW.

    If I mocked comic creators for not having a "real job", I would be just as wrong... despite the existence of shit-stains like Marville.

    Linkara, I admire your effort with this thing. Really, I do--I obviously lost patience with it long before you did, and all it took to make me lose my patience was that one sentence! And I did scream and flip the bird at the screen when you told me it was okay, but damn it, that wasn't enough.

    Like I said, I admire the DECORUM you maintained with this god-awful piece of shit, and I remain a loyal fan. Thank you for sticking up for those of us who study anthropology. I owe you a hug if I ever meet you in real life. :)
  • Akai
    What were they smoking when they made this series?
  • The_Irate_Reader
    I've been re-watching the Doom comic review. The nameless marine makes a lot more sense than this BS, primarily because he sticks with what he knows. His statements have the ring of truth to them ("Now I'm radioactive! That can't be good!") and he's effectively acknowledged to be insane. Also, his motivations are clear (Kill all demons) and his dialogue is enjoyable in a so-bad-it's-good kind of way. There's even a scene of true love (What is more beautiful than a steroid abusing space marine and his gun indeed?).

    This? I would say that this is worse. The characters are insane and stupid, but not enjoyably so. The logic and consistency of the story makes no sense from the perspective of either our universe or their own (Seriously, the main character is from the year 5002. Wouldn't he already know if there was a world war 3 or not [though considering what a dumbass he is I wouldn't be surprised if he just never learned]?) the morals are confusing and contradictory, continuity is even worse than a comic where one of the thought boxes is "Now I'm somewhere else!", and I would argue that the Doom marine has a better arc (he achieves his goal of killing demons and getting progressively bigger and bigger guns, while these guys... I'm not sure what they've accomplished) and is more heroic (he's killing demons, what's not heroic about that?).

    If your comic makes less sense and your characters are less well-rounded than the fragging DOOM GUY your comic has reached a new level of suckage. Also, Doom guy has better quotes.
  • tiffanybride
    avatar
    16:23...bred for its skills in magic.
  • ThatGuyInTheHeadband
    avatar
    Didn't think it was possible, but I think this comic shows there's someone more out of touch with reality then I am, and that's saying something. Well, at least I know this won't keep me from becoming president of a major comic company. XD

    Seriously, what the heck is up with this comic. Not only does 'Wolverine being the first human' seem like something that should be parody and not acting as a metaphor, but I can't tell if this takes place in the Marvel Universe or not. I mean, 2nd issue I can handwave with this being a comedy, but this. You have Wolverine as an actual person, but you also have the characters refer to Spider-man as a fictional character with what he represents and the true tragedy of his origin and stuff. So which is it?
  • SSH
    avatar
    Okay, first off I get the idea that some people at religion is evil, but then this is the stupid people, bain Griffin, is not someone you're supposed to look up to. Yes there are preachers out there in the world that subvert Jesus's teachings, hack half of the Christchurch completely ignores Jesus. But that itself does not mean Christianity is evil, just like we cannot blame Judaism, and every other religion. There are crazy everything. Also yes two animals of different species can make babies and those babies can be fertile as well, you know what that example is us! Everything that has been pointed out and StarTrek!
    I know some of these are fictional but still, if further life is the problem Mr. Jim, also Jack are you sure these are the people who are going to stop WW3, or causing the conflict because, you know who caused wWII or are you saying it was a good idea to make two clones of him?
  • Spacedin
    avatar
    Okay, first of all the science and philosophy is really MESSED UP in this thing. Granted, the argument that you can't prove or disprove God or evolution, because we weren't there is a solid argument used by many a fine philosopher. But by showing the creation of the world in his comic, he disproves the argument he just made!

    Secondly, his inconsistent, obvious lack of understanding of science, philosophy, and evidence from either side of the creation vs evolution debate is so poor that not even a theistic evolutionist would accept his mixed up theories. I don't think this guy knows what he believes. Everybody asks the question "Where did I come from?" or "How did I get here?", but you don't make a comic explaining it, when clearly you don't even know what you believe or even remotely understand in the first place. So before you make this sort of thing ...DO SOME STINKING RESEARCH BUDDY!
  • Extreme-Madness
    avatar
    "Granted, the argument that you can't prove or disprove God or evolution, because we weren't there is a solid argument..."


    No it is not a solid argument. Of course, no one can prove that God exists or not (or whatever you called god). This philosophical question has nothing to do with evolution.

    Evolution has long been proven and constantly over again proves with each new evidence and research.

    Some kind of alleged debate between evolution versus creationism, exists only in the minds of creationists, and who can not understand the definition of evolution and how evolution actually works in the first place.
  • SchrodingersCat  - Evidence for evolution
    " Granted, the argument that you can't prove or disprove God or evolution, because we weren't there is a solid argument"

    1: the observation of anti-biotic resistance developing in bacteria, and the development of resistance to anti-viral medication, by viruses.

    2:Fossil evidence (which can be radio-carbon-dated) and the stratification of those fossils.

    3: DNA and RNA analysis.

    In your own words "...DO SOME STINKING RESEARCH BUDDY!".
  • Dacilriel
    Wow... that's just... that's just so much fail on so many levels. I don't even know where to start.

    Those women did not look like Neanderthals; they looked like modern swimsuit models. It's well-established that plenty of species can interbreed if they are closely related. Evolution does not follow a set path. Scientists have not witnessed the whole span of evolution, but it is easy to observe natural selection over course of a few generations of some plant and animal species. Neanderthals had fire for cooking and for warmth. Speaking of which, they would have been dressed much more practically for a cold climate. They are supposed to be staying in one place through all of this, but they left from New York, the asteroid hit in the Gulf of Mexico, and Neanderthals lived in Europe. What do Jewish dinosaurs and otters mutating into humans have to do with preventing WWIII? And yes, I did flip off the screen when invited to do so because my anthropology teacher was awesome!

    Whew, that was a relief. I think my brain just threw up inside my skull.
  • Sesquipedalia
    A species is DEFINED by their ability to produce fertile offspring. Mules, for instance, are a cross between a horse and a donkey, but are infertile and unable to pass on their genes. From this we can conclude that horses and donkeys are two separate species.

    It's not about theories, Bill Jemas, it's about how science defines the term species.
  • Falconfly
    avatar
    ....Depends. There's actually something of a debate on how species are defined, because many animals thought to represent different species can reproduce and produce fertile offspring.
    Chances are, "species" is a very loose term in the end, just like every taxonomic term (there's a reason why we use cladistics nowadays, you know).


    Tetrapod Zoology had a wonderful article on that.
  • Dacilriel
    Wolves and domestic dogs are classified as different species, but they can produce fertile offspring.
  • Hardback247
    Actually, domestic dogs are a subspecies of wolf.
  • Youngbountygirl
    Anyone that knew this comic was going to be more stupid, raise your hand. (looks around and sees everyone's hands are raised) Take a shot.
  • SSH
    avatar
    please do not turn the comic book into a drinking game we want people to be alive for the next episode. Unless you're a Dragon, then I'm pretty sure you'll live through this. Although you will still wish you were dead.
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