Valve, for a company who cares about the fans...this is simply a low blow for them. Damn you corporate rules!

Dude, coldguy left 4 dead 1 was just a test the makers weren't very happy with it cause they were rushed, left 4 dead 2 is supposed to be what the Group that made it what they wanted left 4 dead 1 to be

If that was the case, they should've, at some point, been very clear and transparent about that after the release of the first game before unveiling L4D2. It's simply bad form, especially for Valve, to have pulled this sort of move, especially since history has shown that even a relatively rushed game can be improved through patches, mods, updates, and even DLC if needed.

And if L4D was just a test, why the hell would they charge as much as they did for it?

At any rate, thanks Joe for making this video, and I'll have to think of other corporate BS to throw your way to decode in the future...though I'm afraid that'll lead to more machine on machine action.

What'd really be cool is if this sort of concept actually developed to some sort of investigative reporting stuff...kind of like acting like a real game journalist or something.

If you are going to test the market, PC only $20 episode or bundle it with a feature game for $60. That is how you test the market.

Quite. *adjusts monocle, and puffs on a pipe* It actually would've been nice if L4D followed the Burnout Paradise formula - release free updates/patches that notably modify the gameplay...then drop the price of the title significantly and begin releasing actual paid DLC...it does a nice job of supporting the game post release to help give early adopters something to keep coming back, while using tactics to draw in new players in a way that is a bit more financially viable than TF2...if that was Valve's concern regarding the financial logistics of doing the same kind of support with L4D.

I agree. But also if they cared about us fans, we'd see an announcement for Half Life 2 episode 3.

but you also have to remember that they're in a business where you have to make money to survive. i mean what all could they have really done, add another level... all the levels are pretty much kinda the same, just different surroundings wee, and different weapons... im not really sure what other weapons they could add to it. but they made a pretty good/enjoyable game without really much content and l4d2 will probably be pretty good as well, why even say anything bad about it? that's like me being mad at call of duty 4 for not having a patch in a long time to fix a lot of bugs when the sequel is about to come out that's going to have the new stuff that i want in the first place, oooh well... money money money!

If companies catered just to the fans, there'd be a lot more bankrupt companies out there.

That is not true. Left for Dead is not a test, it has been in development for 4 years. Since the original zombie mod came out for CS I remember hearing people talking about it while in a Zombie game. Ahh the good ol' days.

This is why you never buy something for what it should be, but for what it currently is.

I know Valve is known for being trustworthy, but live and learn.

If LFD1 wasn't done upon release, no one should have bought it until it was done. I have yet to buy it.

For such a company that cares about the fans, they certainly haven't been doing a good job on this whole "Episodic gameplay" thing have they? It's been HOW long since the last episode of Half LIfe 2?

Valve cares about the fans, or at least the money in their wallets. Come on man, face the facts that no company really gives a shit about you unless you're willing to pay for their games, and i don't blame them for that, but don't try to picture them as nice people instead of shadowy busyness men.

Oh, and last i forget, your mom.

Have they ever, really though?
I mean, they've always taken an ass load of time to create something, not a bad thing in itself, take your time and make something good, fine, but some could consider it way too long.

Best example would be Half Life 2 episodes. They designed that idea to give the player what is essentially HL3 quicker, at lower cost and more frequently. Well...they got the price thing right but...it's been 18 months since Orange Box (which was already delayed on the Pc in order to make the console versions, another "fuck you" to the Pc fans) and the only thing we've seen of Episode 3 is a single piece of concept art. That's it.

Not to mention Orange Box was a slap in the face for another reason. They were making Black Box, which was Episode 2, Portal and TF2, at a cheaper rate than Orange Box. Then they axed it and forced people to buy HL2 and Ep1 over again.

It's been a while, I think, since Valve have really looked after their fans. I think it's only now people are waking up to it.

Hahahaha. Nice one Joe.

That's kinda infuriating, but what I'd like to know is where the hell is Half Life 2: episode 3, or just strait up Half Life 3?

Come on valve, you left me on a cliff hanger for almost 2 years, and yet not a single sign of the conclusion?

Edit: Now that I think about it, am I the only one who thinks Joe struck frighteningly close to the real truth?

Because, as noted by the lines of the boycott crew, a lot of people bought L4D under the pretense that it was going to get the same kind of treatment TF2 did - post-release content and support to help flesh out the game, add new variety and depth, and make it something that grew with the community.

Releasing a sequel only a year after the original is not only completely contrary to this concept, but is incredibly unlike Valve.

One other point is that while it might've cost as much to release the same content to L4D as DLC, it wouldn't involve users having to buy two physical games, and would have less of a chance of fragmenting the user base...or least would not have as much potential in fragmenting the userbase as having a sequel will have.

I and a bunch of people bought it for the Sole Purpose of killing Zombies.

With all do respect, I have to disagree with you thinking it's too soon for a sequel. Wasn't GTA Vice City released one year after GTA 3? It certainly didn't split up the community and it had a ton of new stuff.

Two key problems with your point:

1. GTA3 is not a multiplayer focused/only game, which requires a community of support in order to really sustain itself, whereas L4D (much like TF2) is more more focused on being a multiplayer game. GTA3 doesn't have a community to fragment/split up, so that part of the point is completely moot.

2. Rockstar North never made a promise for post release support for GTA3. Valve did for L4D.

About #2 they said they they WILL continue to support L4D. They said it at E3, and they're starting to. And you have to understand that not all the fans are much into DLC. Some fans just want to play the games. If you want to boycott the game you can but I'm going to give this game a chance buy or rent

At this point, words are cheap.

So far their support has consisted of adding ONE map which is only used for a specialized survival mode, allowed for other campaign maps to be used in Versus mode (which were already in the game in the first place), and only recently released the SDK stuff for modders to make maps, IIRC.

DLC does not always equal buying for new content. Patches and updates are considered DLC, too.

And Atirador...I don't buy for a second that chances/updates couldn't 'fit' in to L4D. The rather notable gameplay balance/changes that have been made in TF2 still fit in the game back to the original maps the game came with, and if any dev could make changes occur through patches or DLC, Valve could.

Up until the announcement of L4D2, a lot of people that I knew simply thought Valve was taking their time crafting the post-release content for the game...but afterwards, it's hard to tell whether they were very serious about that promise in the first place.

We'll see how it pans out...but at this point, what Valve says they'll do doesn't matter so much as what they actually end up doing.

But they're still supporting it. Let's just wait and see if they continue with the DLC. And you have to keep in mind that typical DLC isn't a lot of stuff.

I respect your opinion but please respect mine

I've said nothing that represents disrespect for your opinion. I disagree with your assertion that Valve is still supporting L4D, simply because they /say/ that they're still supporting it.

That's simply the point I'm making.

Most of the people in this forum seem to forget the fact that most of the game alterations in left 4 dead's sequel couldn't really fit into left 4 dead one. The weapons are fine and shouldn't have been messed with. New characters need a new setting, and that just happens to sound a lot like a sequel to me. And new infected bring new game mechanics that also fit in with a brand new game. I understand the anger most people have against valve for such a short release time between the two games, but the original Left 4 Dead couldn't be altered except with maybe a few new campaigns and the survival mode that is already in the game.

I'm not saying that i approve of this sequel, I'm probably not going to buy it, I'm just gonna give it a chance and play it at a friends house. But the alterations that they made to Left 4 Dead's sequel are shit, just plain shit.

The only new infected to date is the Charger (Half a Tank), created for one purpose, substitute that second hunter in versus without making an actual tank spawn every 30 seconds.

The melee weapons look extremely over powered, for the fact that two hits with a frying pan do the same job as ten rounds of a high powered combat rifle.

The incendiary bullets seem like an idea a ten year-old came up with because the valve idea bucket was running dry, i mean, come on, fiery bullets... stop and think, fiery bullets are one step above the people who believe in reptilians.

The characters in the next game are just pitiful, and no, I'm not gonna say the same shit half the people in this forum keep saying "Zoey is way hotter then the next bitasdbaosdnasbdhavsdjn penis", but the next characters might as well be cardboard cutouts of the usual survival-horror movie cast, "because we really need to add TWO black people into the game so everybody knows we're not racist" says valve a week after releasing left 4 dead one.

All i can really do is sit an watch as valve cashes-in with all of the submissive X-box owners that just love liking the balls of mainstream companies and smiling about it as they wipe their mouths, and i can't really blame valve for being so fucking clever. I really have to give it to the boy cotters, at least they're trying to fix the fact that valve is just releasing a shitty sequel that could have been so much more. Oh wow, there i go again, my imagination actually deceived me and made me think that the average X-Box owner is smarter then a fifth grader with a piece of metal sticking through its head. Oh well... i guess I'll just live with the shitty games companies such as valve release every once in a while...

But then again, it's not like i ever expected any better from valve, their just a game company just like any other out there, and they certainly don't give a shit about you or me, or any forum on the internet.

But then again, i don't need to buy Left 4 Dead 2 to entertain myself, I have your mom, and the mothers of some of the people that left comments in this very page, so i guess i have a pretty busy schedule before they release Left 4 Dead 3.

I think you're jumping to conclusions. The charger isn't the only new infected, there's two or three more coming.

To me I have have to see more of the melee weapons to judge for myself. We haven't seen the chainsaw.

The fire bullets might not be smart but it looks fun from what I saw.

As for the characters I don't thinks it's fair to judge the characters based on so little information.

To me I say let's wait and find out more about this game before we make a judgement.

valve... u f***** up big time!!

Just calm down O.K. They said that they would continue to support the first game and they had a good track record so far. Let's just wait till Nov to make a judgement

I love L4D. I play it since it's release almost every day.(often with some tweaks to keep it fresh. like 2 players and no bots, speedruns or just trying mods and custom lvls) and I could surly play it another year like that with DLCs even longer. But I'm looking forward to L4D2 and I will probably buy it the day it comes out.

Well, i play with your mother since release day. I hope that doesn't make me a psycho.

I believe you are correct, Joe, that the call of profit potential is what made Left 4 Dead content into Left 4 Dead 2: Electric Bugaloo.

At least it'll plummet the resale price of the original Left 4 Dead, be easy to convince 3 other people to play the game who haven't yet.

I was as skeptical as anyone else on this topic, and just recently found out about the boycott of L4D2 (And just found it funny as hell XD).
While I am royally peeved about the corporate bullshit they spoonfeed us about L4D's new content, and how they act like L4D2 is breaking all of the walls they built in L4D (which were some very shotty walls even if they looked cool, if you can get that analogy )
HOWEVER!
I do have faith that these people do have at least one functioning braincell left to know that if they fuck up THIS game by making it halfass, there will be severe financial comeuppons. >:l
So until that point, I'll stay away from a pre-order and let my trusty critics like gamespot and this site of course judge the game on its own merit before I know if it's good enough to buy =) Here's to L4D2!

....YOU BETTER BE BADASS >:l

lol welcome to the new age of Corporatism... The age were companies set policies, not the customers.

They have another name for that i think? It has something to do with Nazis... O yes, Fascism!

Did you just try to compare the Nazi party to Valve? Isn't that a bit of an exaggeration? I mean, yeah, this whole LFD and LFD2 thing is kinda fucked up... but it's capitalism my friend. It's what puts heat in your jammies good man.

And please, it's not even close to fascism. Sorry to get hung up on this, but people love to throw words around they don't fully understand.

Your best video. Thoughtful and sincere. More like this please. Left 4 Dead 2 will still sell, but the competition from content heavy Modern Warfare 2 will shoot Valves enthusiasm down.

l4d look so good but it not on ps3 with is bs but i hope they do not f*** up half-life 2 ep3 or portal 2 or black mase

I personally couldn't care less since i decided to completely skip on L4D.But coming up with a sequel a little over a year later is just plain weird.They could've easily used all that new stuff as DLC.That's one thing that Bethesda and Criterion gets right.

Escort missions?! you can fuck off Joe! Escort missions are the bane of gaming existence. Other than that great show joe. I started out hating your shows but over time with the changes you have made I have become a fan.

I dont think releasing the sequel to l4d is a big deal. l4d was worth the 60 bucks. and if you add up all the cost of dlc (if it were dlc instead of a sequel) you are looking at about $50 anyway. 10 for each scene plus some multiplayer stuff. not only that but my hard drive is full anyway. I dont get what the hubub is about.

if you think about it they would stand to make more money just by offering dlc instead of splitting their cash with retail and boxes. Maybe they arent bullshitting after all. they should have made good on their content promises though

The reported reason valve is not releasing new xbox content for their games is microsoft wants them to make them purchasable while valve wants it to be free. That's why tf2 updates aren't coming to the 360. Valve wants dlc to be free but microsoft says we have to pay for them. Thats why their holding out. they want to put as much game as possible in their dlc if we have to pay 10 dollars for it.

thatdudeinthekhakis wrote:

they want to put as much game as possible in their dlc if we have to pay 10 dollars for it.

That'd make sense...if L4D2 was being released as DLC for L4D, but that's not really the case.

I know about the whole case with MS not letting them release updates for TF2 for free (which makes zero sense, as EA was able to pull that with Burnout Paradise), and even if that was the case, couldn't they theoretically release that content to the PS3 for free, since MS isn't controlling them there for TF2?

I dunno, there's just a lot of either conflicting or simply inconsistent information about this whole issue, and that lack of transparency is what really makes it all frustrating.

Left for dead 2 could be just dlc but that would be because valve is being pressured by it's bosses to capitalize on l4d popularity when it wants the game to be free dlc. If it weren't for it's popularity valve would probably be less rushed for a sequel. Besides l4d is just valves experiment to see if people will by zombie games. They are using it to distract us from the delays for hl2 episode 3.

That doesn't make so much sense, given Valve's background, which can once again relate back to TF2, which not only is a popular game, but is a game that still is selling well years after its release due to the post release content and support.

Valve is its own boss, as it is its own publisher, if I'm not mistaken.

Yep, and my dick is a delicious tootsie pop. Get sucking.

Step 1: Release lackluster game with intriguing multiplayer components.
Step 2: $$$
Step 3: Convince everyone that the next game in line is what the previous was really intended to be.
Step 4: Repeat.

Joe and his bullshit translator are absolutely right. "DLC" these days is just one big rod we are getting right in our asses. No lube.

Left 4 Dead 2 might be a decent game, but at the end of the day your ass is gonna be sore and your wallet empty.

While I agree with some of your points, McBeaver, I personally could do without some of the...colorful word choice and imagery. Otherwise, very valid points.

I really hope the general VG press actually calls Valve to task on L4D2 when the actual reviews start rolling in.

Yes you made all the good points about how Valve just fucked allot of people right in their wallets. I remember how those bastards promised about the game director that would be easily to use and the user would be able to make their own maps.

Cocksucking liars that released the first DLC in late April to a game that was released in November and the BETA SDK in MAY and now the FULL SDK in LATE June. How can you not have ready the map editor for a multiplayer game ready the same time you release the game or a month after to a FUCKING 6 year old engine with some improvements. Far Cry 2 had the map editor included in the game. Fallout 3 had the SDK released a month after the game release. Oh and how come the guys at Bethesda didn't release a full priced game for every DLC they released because of new weapons, new maps and new characters. Well Bethesda has integrity.

Fucking Valve should be ashamed because it's clearly that after they released L4D they shelved the game and started work on L4D2. I'm clearly going to BOYCOTT the game and any other product of theirs only after they release HALF-LIFE 2 EPISODE 3.

Oh and I think Angry Joe's reference to Xbox 360 users were always getting screwed was a reference to the fact that Halo 2 and Halo 3 use the same engine and almost the same mechanics and Gears of War 1 and 2 also use the same engine, gameplay, mechanics with just some tweaks and new colors.
PS: great reference to They Live although it was the other way aroud. You have to put glasses to see the truth. But yeah beer goggles make you see crappy things like GOLD.

Well, PC gamers are more used to having a game be put out and then having some sort of extended post release support done through mods, patches, expansion packs, and such, whereas console gamers are generally more used to simply buying new games (as in the past it was impossible to patch/update releases on consoles, traditionally).

L4D2 is definitely a more console-centric response to L4D from Valve, and some speculate that the sales on the console side were strong enough, and surprising enough, to convince Valve that doing a sequel route would ultimately be more profitable than trying to coax in new users progressively through patching/updating, ala TF2.

Damn it, Joe, stop giving them ideas for future sequels!

Subsequently, the new format of the show is REALLY working well. Love the banter with the video screen.

Looks like he's broadcasting from the center of some high tech lair of sorts. It's a nice touch.

I think DLC has become bullshit!

For some games the DLC comes out like 2 days after release!

I hope that Valve doesn't become a DLC whore.

Yeah look at Capcom and there games.

Valve is a company that care about there fans? Are you serious? They never did, they even fucked up Counter-Strike, how do you even do that?

Left4Dead Casuality sounds like it would make a pretty decent DLC campaign

I only tried out L4D for a bit just to see what the whole hype about was. I do give it to Valve for making a zombie shoot-em-up fan's dream come true for the gaming community. The hook factor on this titled must of sent red flags to Valve wondering if they would do anything to make this game better with DLC. Believe me that other companies would do the same. As you said Joe like Oblivion with The Shivering Ilise add-on.

What I now fully understand from this video "review" (I guess) about what Valve is doing is no different than what other companies try to strive for. Milking there titles. Pure and simple. It happened with Lucasarts with the X-Wing series, which kicked ass with a great mod community to back it up. Metal Gear and it's titles when MGS2: Substance came out for Xbox first than to PS2 and the Ac!D titles for Metal Gear...sheesh.

L4D2 is just like that and for them to call out the date for this before the first game to ever come out is just warning signs to those who can read pass...well...THE BULLSHIT! (Give this to AVGN/James to see if this reads as Bullshit to him). Why don't we see a Nintendo game ever falling victim to this? Because Nintendo know how to keep there 'A list' games free from this kind of bullshit. Zelda never had this cuz...oh let's see...they delay the game to make it worth! Mario is just simple and everyone enjoys it even with a few misses like Mario Shine. Even with PSN and Xbox Live members doing the DLC know it's addon for the original base core game design and not an expensive download of a whole new title just because it needs the already made software. L4D2 abuses this to the fullest unless Valve pulls a fast one on us making it buyable because they added some new features from the ground up that only there coding and gaming engine is superior than L4D. Then you have to buy it which will piss off the consumer if it turns out to be a simple core gaming engine that has a few simple C++ word changes in it.

It has happen before...please Valve...don't fall victim to this bullshit.

I don't know. I love Valve and I'm waiting for Meet the Pyro and Meet the Medic, I don't care much about Left 4 Dead.

Although, HELL. You know what I want for the 360? Games you can play with your real life buddy and online. No 360 games do this as far as I know except for the Halo series and Left 4 Dead, and I don't like Halo. I think I made the wrong choice of even getting a 360, because I don't like the games, the PC is superior, and THERE'S NO SPLITSCREEN ONLINE. RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGE!

I'm really getting tired of this...

Does anyone remember who made this game?

At all?

Their the people that have given us some of the best games since their very first, even releasing three absolutely great games at once for only $60 and not only that, but with free content from one of them.

Team Fortress 2.

If it were any other company, they would have released all of those games separately for the same price of $60, but they didn't.

PLUS, Valve only ports their games to the consoles so that they can make money like every other respectable business does which is why you don't see them updating them as much as the PC versions.

They made games for the PC when they started and only for the PC.

So, since players have the computer at their finger tips, they can make some great and interesting maps for the community.

For free.

Now I admit, they did screw the pooch with them promising downloadable content for their last game, Left 4 Dead which I can imagine ticking some people off, but this is ridiculous.

I can only imagine what it would it be like it they didn't promising the DLC...

But, like they said it was an experiment. I myself wonder why they didn't tell us, however they just probably wanted to see how it would sell. But, at least they aren't like a certain company out there, releasing the same fucking guitar game every few months, while daring to call it a different game.

Now, that's robbery.

*cough* Guitar Hero *cough*

Considering all the spin-offs and the fact that a fifth one is coming out.

Ugh.

Now for the points the boycotts have made.

Half of it is not false, but out dated as Valve has stated in a recent gamer pro issue, I believe, that they've been trying to see if they can make the first L4D work with the new L4D2, so at least they're trying.

All the other points I can agree with, however Valve has really added a lot with this new game that's coming out and for Valve; the company that takes almost a decade to make a game, says a lot.

Now...

There are around four new zombies to be announced. Remember, this is including the previous zombies, so that's a about eight right there.

Five campaigns.

New character models along with new voice work. High quality considering it's Valve.

An actual story, although I like it when the story was vague. Gave it a bit more of a mysterious feel considering the environment told you the story.

New zombie physics.

Improved A.I Director, along with the new ability to mess with the map.

Now, you have to admit, that's a lot of content. Which the DLC for it will be free considering it's mostly Microsoft and EA that try and make Valve have the DLC have a price tag on it like they did with TF2...

And look at companies like Bungie, releasing a map pack for 'round $20.

Eh...

Seriously now, Valve has been so nice and generous to use over the years.

And like I previously hinted at before, they are a business. They have to make money somehow and considering how slow their games come out I'd imagine them being behind at some points, even with their great games with today's economy..

Anyway, that's all I have to say for now.

But, on a side note.

A better title for the game would have been.

Left 2 Die.

Eh?

Flamma Man, you make valid points, but the underlying reason why people have responded the way they did is because this is Valve, and it was odd enough for them to announce such a sequel in such a short timespan after the first game came out. In addition to that, they did so after having pretty much no transparency about what they were doing with L4D in the first place (like being slow to release the SDK, among other things), which simply adds up to L4D and L4D2 being the most un-Valve like pairing of games ever to come out of that company.

Every single one of the additions they're making in L4D2 are things that could've been implemented in L4D as far as I can tell through some form of patching or DLC (paid DLC if they were that concerned about money).

The only way they could make the first L4D work with L4D2, from what I see, is if they allow something similar to what we have in Rock Band 2, where you can 'install' the campaigns from L4D to your hard drive, and access/play them from L4D2 in some way. However, that's just a guess, and doesn't really address the initial promises they made about how they were going to treat L4D in the first place.

When you as a company explicitly say that you're going to support a game "Like Team Fortress 2," that's a very high standard you're setting, and falling somewhat short of it would be understandable...but this overall treatment has felt more like them ducking and crawling under the hurdle as opposed to not quite jumping over it.

Oh, and Left 2 Die? Definitely a much classier title.

that insinuates that there's only 2 players

Perhaps, but at the very least, it would've made for a classy subtitle for the game.

ohh, screeney has a girlfriend
Great video. The game... can't say anything about it

I've talked about this on many message boards and I just think it's people whining too much.

Really, there's enough new content that it'd be real hard to make into a free DLC pack. I'm not saying that it's not possible, but it's just not economically feasible for them.

If anything, I'd like to see them have compatibility between the two games so I can play L4D campaigns and L4D2 campaigns all through the same game.

In the meantime, I'm enjoying some of the custom map campaigns that have come out since Valve released the SDK. If you got the PC version, check it out.

It's kinda sad how you guys think valve is bad, I mean how long has EA been doing this sort of thing. I'm not trying to defend valve(I'm not even a big fan), but it bugs me how much your mad about L4D2 yet a lot of people keep buying Guitar Hero/Rock Band(yeah they are getting there) spin offs, all of the EA sport games, and stuff like that. Remember valve is a company and they can do what ever they want with it, you my not agree but it won't make valve stop. Also great vid, but I think the monitor should have his own episode. Also no one is making you buy L4D2, they are not holding a gun to your head. And remember also this is a company that gladly lets the costumer mod content for games they made(using their SDK). How many other company let you do that, and I mean give out the SDK not looking for a 3rd party tool. Bottom line is, they made a game and now they are making another game. You complain and whine, yet you don't mind all the Rock Band and Guitar Hero spin offs(and GH is worse since songs don't intermingle with the other games like in R, because I remember RB2 coming out almost a year after RB (11/20/07 US for RB1, and 09/14/08 US for RB2). Yet everyone was going nuts for it to come out, and it was pretty much the same game with some added features. And now you have Lego Rock Band, Rock Bandearl Jam, The Beatles: Rock Band; no one is complaining they just want to play the dang games. So explain to me why hate L4D2 and valve if most are ok with spin off's and updates of other games?

Well, in the case of, say, Rock Band 2, here's the difference -

Rock Band 2 was designed as something that stacked alongside Rock Band 1 in every way. You could import almost all the tracks from the first game into the second game, the pricing was actually good for the number of songs you got (over 100 songs IIRC when you included the free DLs they packed with the game).

Plus, all the DLC they have released has consistently been supported in both Rock Band 1 and 2 (at least I think that's still the case), so if you didn't want to get RB2, you still were getting post release content and support from the developers. This is still different than the case we're talking about here.

I'm not saying Valve is evil or anything, or that other companies are better than Valve...this is just a very un-Valve like sort of game to be putting out.

I bought L4D the day it released, i enjoyed it but I've always had the gut feeling i payed to much for this little content. Sure it has replay value but the same 4 missions over and over again did not satisfy long term.
I for one am not going to buy l4d2 because i already payed €45 to beta test it over the past year.
I had plans to create multiple survivor maps but right after they released the SDK they announced L4D2 and my will to do so just died right there. In fact i haven't played L4D any more since they announced L4D2.

I was so hyped for L4D and now i couldn't give a rats ass for L4D2. Sure i'll check out the vids when they are released but i have no desire whatsoever to buy L4D2. From what I've seen so far there is nothing that revolutionizes the game from the first. In fact i find that it looks to much like the first game.

There is a part of me that wants to see L4D2 fall flat on it's face but i know it will be sold just because it is L4D only improved.

Well, I admit it was odd for them to announce a sequel so quietly, but keep in mind they they did say that they started to immediately work on the sequel.

So, they did have a year to work on it, but that's not saying much, admittedly...

However we also have to keep in mind that this was an original game by Turtle studios, so they may has a different method of working.

However, now I'm just trying to defend Valve considering I'm a fan.

It just pisses me off that people are complaining about this, when so many other companies are doing worse.

I get what you're saying, I really do. I'm a big fan of what Valve does in general, too. Just don't interpret people getting pissed at Valve over this doesn't mean that they're not pissed at what other companies have pulled/will pull on us as consumers.

I call bullshit on the whole deal when a game company stops thinking about $ to think about fans ill see hell frozen over.
On a side note may i use that bullshit translator of yours for some bethesda content, more immediately fallout3 and its "sequel"

Controversy...? THIS IS CAPITALISM!

Sorry guys but the one true thing is: If a company thinks I can make more money by releasing a full-price game, instead of supporting the old one it will do so. They don't care if they drive some fans away with that, as long they think they will make more money with that.

Blizzard is doing the same with their StarCraft 2 Trilogy, each installment is going to cost about 50$. If you guys don't boycott these games, they will keep on doing that.

I'm not paying 60$ for a patch. Period.

Also - SC2 is a trilogy? ugh; if that happens there will be more pirated copies than bought copies.

Also, more clever title:
Left 2 Die